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	<title>Comments on: What does Iain Dale&#8217;s failure say about modern electoral politics?</title>
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	<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/</link>
	<description>Looking Forward to Freedom</description>
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		<title>By: tim leunig</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2534</link>
		<dc:creator>tim leunig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Oct 2009 20:04:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2534</guid>
		<description>next mayor of london?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>next mayor of london?</p>
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		<title>By: Dick Puddlecote</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2521</link>
		<dc:creator>Dick Puddlecote</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 23:28:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2521</guid>
		<description>@Belinda: &lt;em&gt;&quot;I think a parliament of doctors would be fine&quot;&lt;/em&gt;

That would be my idea of hell on earth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Belinda: <em>&#8220;I think a parliament of doctors would be fine&#8221;</em></p>
<p>That would be my idea of hell on earth.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Littlewood</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2520</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Littlewood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 23:03:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2520</guid>
		<description>@ Belinda. I&#039;m certainly not against scientifically-minded people being MPs, but I would hope that most MPs would basically be intelligent generalists who would know how and where to access sensible information.

@Peter. I&#039;m really quite amazed that anyone could describe Iain Dale as &quot;just a party hack&quot;. he runs one of the most successful blogs in modern British politics and is probably on the national media as much as any other Tory. I&#039;m not saying Dale would have been a better choice for the Tories than Stewart, merely that you have totally misunderstood the former.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Belinda. I&#8217;m certainly not against scientifically-minded people being MPs, but I would hope that most MPs would basically be intelligent generalists who would know how and where to access sensible information.</p>
<p>@Peter. I&#8217;m really quite amazed that anyone could describe Iain Dale as &#8220;just a party hack&#8221;. he runs one of the most successful blogs in modern British politics and is probably on the national media as much as any other Tory. I&#8217;m not saying Dale would have been a better choice for the Tories than Stewart, merely that you have totally misunderstood the former.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Welch</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2519</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Welch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 21:40:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2519</guid>
		<description>It is parochial to worry about Dale to be honest. I like the man but he is just a party hack.  

Rory Stewart would have been quite a different proposition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is parochial to worry about Dale to be honest. I like the man but he is just a party hack.  </p>
<p>Rory Stewart would have been quite a different proposition.</p>
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		<title>By: BelindaBG</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2518</link>
		<dc:creator>BelindaBG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 21:03:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2518</guid>
		<description>I think a parliament of doctors would be fine and much better than a parliament which plumbs the depths of scientific ignorance like the present one. I cannot think of a single member of the government who is scientifically literate (and certainly not any of the women).

The two parliamentarians I know personally who are medics, Evan Harris and Brian Iddon, have contributed a great deal to medical and scientific debate. They  tend to be more &#039;liberal&#039; over the big questions like drug criminalisation etc, perhaps  because their allegiance is to the scientific evidence rather than to pandering to a tabloid fears or a vocal  minority.  Obviously it depends whether the Tory whip will allow any new Tory doc. the freedom to express an  opinion.

Aside from the economy, the big policy challenges facing new MPs are the environment and the NHS. So in general the more doctors the better, bring them on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think a parliament of doctors would be fine and much better than a parliament which plumbs the depths of scientific ignorance like the present one. I cannot think of a single member of the government who is scientifically literate (and certainly not any of the women).</p>
<p>The two parliamentarians I know personally who are medics, Evan Harris and Brian Iddon, have contributed a great deal to medical and scientific debate. They  tend to be more &#8216;liberal&#8217; over the big questions like drug criminalisation etc, perhaps  because their allegiance is to the scientific evidence rather than to pandering to a tabloid fears or a vocal  minority.  Obviously it depends whether the Tory whip will allow any new Tory doc. the freedom to express an  opinion.</p>
<p>Aside from the economy, the big policy challenges facing new MPs are the environment and the NHS. So in general the more doctors the better, bring them on.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Littlewood</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2516</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Littlewood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 19:47:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2516</guid>
		<description>Alex Massie, over at The Spectator, seems to share my fears

http://www.spectator.co.uk/alexmassie/5449286/a-parliament-of-doctors.thtml</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alex Massie, over at The Spectator, seems to share my fears</p>
<p><a href="http://www.spectator.co.uk/alexmassie/5449286/a-parliament-of-doctors.thtml" rel="nofollow">http://www.spectator.co.uk/alexmassie/5449286/a-parliament-of-doctors.thtml</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mark Littlewood</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2513</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Littlewood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 14:38:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2513</guid>
		<description>@Bunny. I don&#039;t claim to have hardened stats about the way the open primaries have worked, but my observation would be that (a) they may tend to favour rather parochial candidates and (b) they haven&#039;t done an enormous amount to reach out beyond the party faithful (and when they do, e.g. Bedford, the results are not ideal for the party)

Although I&#039;m highly sympathetic to the Tories&#039; experiment in this area (and deeply frustrated by the old-fashioned, unimaginative, conservative approach of the LibDems), I think the basic problem is actually the (small) size of a Parliamentary constituency.

If you&#039;re well embedded in a local community by - for example - being a church warden, a long-serving GP, a popular headmaster or whatever - you may well be able to prevail upon a personal contacts list of maybe 100 or 200   
voters who are willing to turn up to a caucus and vote for you. That&#039;s probably enough people to tip the balance.

In the USA, however, having a few dozen friends and allies willing to give your career a helpful push won&#039;t be of much statistical help in trying to secure you the nomination to become the Democrat or Republican candidate for the US Senate in, say, Texas - as you might expect a million or so votes to be cast in total.

It stands to reason that larger, more populous caucuses are more likely to be won by candidates with star quality, because a parochial power base is less likely to have much sway. At a wild guess, I&#039;d say that if the Tories had been looking for a candidate for Berkshire, rather than just Bracknell, then Dale would have comfortably defeated Dr Lee.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Bunny. I don&#8217;t claim to have hardened stats about the way the open primaries have worked, but my observation would be that (a) they may tend to favour rather parochial candidates and (b) they haven&#8217;t done an enormous amount to reach out beyond the party faithful (and when they do, e.g. Bedford, the results are not ideal for the party)</p>
<p>Although I&#8217;m highly sympathetic to the Tories&#8217; experiment in this area (and deeply frustrated by the old-fashioned, unimaginative, conservative approach of the LibDems), I think the basic problem is actually the (small) size of a Parliamentary constituency.</p>
<p>If you&#8217;re well embedded in a local community by &#8211; for example &#8211; being a church warden, a long-serving GP, a popular headmaster or whatever &#8211; you may well be able to prevail upon a personal contacts list of maybe 100 or 200<br />
voters who are willing to turn up to a caucus and vote for you. That&#8217;s probably enough people to tip the balance.</p>
<p>In the USA, however, having a few dozen friends and allies willing to give your career a helpful push won&#8217;t be of much statistical help in trying to secure you the nomination to become the Democrat or Republican candidate for the US Senate in, say, Texas &#8211; as you might expect a million or so votes to be cast in total.</p>
<p>It stands to reason that larger, more populous caucuses are more likely to be won by candidates with star quality, because a parochial power base is less likely to have much sway. At a wild guess, I&#8217;d say that if the Tories had been looking for a candidate for Berkshire, rather than just Bracknell, then Dale would have comfortably defeated Dr Lee.</p>
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		<title>By: Dick Puddlecote</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2512</link>
		<dc:creator>Dick Puddlecote</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 13:10:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2512</guid>
		<description>As Bunny said, classic one-liner there, Mark :-)

Unfortunately, your summation of the probable make-up of the next parliament is almost certainly going to be the case. I&#039;ve met my local Tory PPC and she is an interesting character, yet none of the party literature we&#039;ve been getting reflects any of this. It&#039;s 100% centrally-crafted propaganda with the PPC&#039;s personal pictures slotted in here and there.

It&#039;s possible that she could plough her own furrow once elected, but highly unlikely for the very reasons you have highlighted ... especially as she is a former researcher for a high-profile Tory. So probably just Tory voting fodder then.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As Bunny said, classic one-liner there, Mark <img src='http://www.liberal-vision.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Unfortunately, your summation of the probable make-up of the next parliament is almost certainly going to be the case. I&#8217;ve met my local Tory PPC and she is an interesting character, yet none of the party literature we&#8217;ve been getting reflects any of this. It&#8217;s 100% centrally-crafted propaganda with the PPC&#8217;s personal pictures slotted in here and there.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s possible that she could plough her own furrow once elected, but highly unlikely for the very reasons you have highlighted &#8230; especially as she is a former researcher for a high-profile Tory. So probably just Tory voting fodder then.</p>
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		<title>By: Bunny Smedley</title>
		<link>http://www.liberal-vision.org/2009/10/18/what-does-iain-dales-failure-say-about-modern-electoral-politics/comment-page-1/#comment-2511</link>
		<dc:creator>Bunny Smedley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 07:13:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.liberal-vision.org/?p=3507#comment-2511</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I basically want my politicians to be controversial, lazy and rather aloof.&lt;/i&gt;

This made me spill coffee all over my desk - but in a good way. 

One thing, though, Mark, unrelated to the unarguable good sense of the line quoted above - do you think that the &#039;open primary&#039; [i.e. caucus] selection method has much of an impact on the preferred candidate profile you describe? For instance, I can see why the sort of hardened party loyalist-activist whose social life hinges on leaflet delivery and survey cavassing would go for someone similarly inclined - but why would someone who isn&#039;t even a party member care about this?

For me, the real surprise of Bracknell was the choice of a relatively &#039;normal&#039; candidate over the two high-profile ones (Dale and Stewart) - this is what I&#039;ve had expected if the local association had chosen the candidate, but not what I expected from an open primary. 

Does anyone out there have a sense as to the proportion of party members / &#039;outsiders&#039; voting in the meeting? What were the &#039;negatives&#039; aimed at the candidates who didn&#039;t win - e.g. were the high-profile candidates regarded as part-timers who might not show much commitment to the seat? In short I do wish someone who was there would write about this - less out of voyeuristic fascination (well, only a little) than because it might well say something about the selection process more generally.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I basically want my politicians to be controversial, lazy and rather aloof.</i></p>
<p>This made me spill coffee all over my desk &#8211; but in a good way. </p>
<p>One thing, though, Mark, unrelated to the unarguable good sense of the line quoted above &#8211; do you think that the &#8216;open primary&#8217; [i.e. caucus] selection method has much of an impact on the preferred candidate profile you describe? For instance, I can see why the sort of hardened party loyalist-activist whose social life hinges on leaflet delivery and survey cavassing would go for someone similarly inclined &#8211; but why would someone who isn&#8217;t even a party member care about this?</p>
<p>For me, the real surprise of Bracknell was the choice of a relatively &#8216;normal&#8217; candidate over the two high-profile ones (Dale and Stewart) &#8211; this is what I&#8217;ve had expected if the local association had chosen the candidate, but not what I expected from an open primary. </p>
<p>Does anyone out there have a sense as to the proportion of party members / &#8216;outsiders&#8217; voting in the meeting? What were the &#8216;negatives&#8217; aimed at the candidates who didn&#8217;t win &#8211; e.g. were the high-profile candidates regarded as part-timers who might not show much commitment to the seat? In short I do wish someone who was there would write about this &#8211; less out of voyeuristic fascination (well, only a little) than because it might well say something about the selection process more generally.</p>
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